Tuesday, January 02, 2007

Was Jesus Liberal or Conservative?

This is always a fun topic to ponder. I have thought about the idea of Christianity and political party affiliation for quite some time now. I used to attend a church that was a very conservative based group. I even found myself getting sucked into the discussions and group rants of how much we hated the Liberals and Democrats. I then had an epiphany: Can Liberals or Democrats love Jesus as much as I? Can the Liberals and Democrats be doing as much if not more for the kingdom of Gad than I?

I don't remember the Bible saying anything about such things. Well I take that back, the Bible does say, (paraphrased and in the vernacular) "The only way to the Father is through the Son. And the only way to Heaven is to vote Republican." and according to 3rd Samson 22:53, "The Lord shall break through the clouds and take all the Republicans and Conservatives to paradise." Wait..... It never said that. Just kidding.

But on a serious note, I feel as though the church has made it almost taboo to be anything other than republican or "conservative" (what does it mean to be conservative anyway???). If Jesus were to rock through the clouds and step on the scene, I am pretty sure He would be appalled at this whole predestined political party conspiracy within His church.. Well Folks, your thoughts?.


Makeesha said...

Not sure if you noticed Michael but you typoed God as Gad hehe...at least it's still a biblical reference. ;)

I agree, I think Jesus would be appalled. I think Christianity is very political historically. I think that Jesus was very political in fact. But I don't think we could say that Jesus or His Church is supposed to be partisan...very different things.

I have actually heard people say that they couldn't go to a church because any time they talked about their democrat party affiliation and the subjects that went with it they got the "hairy eyeball" from everyone in the church...that's just not right.

David said...

We know someone who said they we're Biblocrats cause that's what Jesus was.

Sam said...

to be a christian and a democrat is imposible. since the democrats believe in Homosexuality, abortion, and a lot of other things that God does not like. now if you have a democrat who has christian morals and is truthful about it, then vote for him. and dont for the Republican who doesnt.

Michael said...

Good points Sam. However, i think to say that all democrats believe in abortion and homosexuality would be a gross generalization. I'm sure not all do. Also, correct me if I am wrong but I am pretty sure that it doesn't specifically talk about abortion in the bible. It does however talk about murder and it being wrong. I understand that the bible does talk about homosexuality as being "an abomination" but, it talks about many other things that are displeasing to God(Not Gad Makeesha...) Things we all do on a daily basis. I don't think I need to go into those things do I? In any case I know that God would never turn someone away from his loving grace. I screw up more than anyone I know and Jesus still loves me. That's why I have a relationship with Jesus, His love is unconditional for everyone.

Michael said...

GAD is the Female side of God Makeesha! JUST JOKING!! PLEASE DON'T HATE POST THIS COMMENT.......

John Lynch said...

Sam, we welcome the spectrum of thought here & are happy to host your opinion. I should mention, though, we strongly encourage people to write humbly, peacefully & with open minds.

Regarding your comment, I disagree. In fact, given the strength of your comment & the public nature of this forum, I have to disagree very strongly.

I have found no evidence throughout all the governments of history of any political party that aligns with Christ's kingdom policy. That includes ours. Democracy & theocracy simply don't coordinate.

Republicans focus on moral no-no's (the hostile side of "truth") but lack compassion. Democrats focus on helping people but frequently lack a moral compass.

I've been a conflicted Republican for years; but will soon be switching to either Democratic or Independent affiliation for reasons both missional & responsible.

I encourage you to think about it from my point of view before dismissing the notion. Also, in my practice & living, I try to hold onto this verse that might also bless you...
1 Corinthians 3:18... "Let no man deceive himself If any man among you thinks that he is wise in this age, he must become foolish, so that he may become wise."

Makeesha said...

Sam, to say it's impossible to be a Christian and a democrat is to suggest that our faith relies on anything but the grace of God and the blood of Christ.

It's actually possible to have same sex attraction and be a Christian just like it's possible to vote for gay marriage and be a Christian.

It's possible to believe that abortion should remain legal and be a Christian. Just like it's possible to HAVE an abortion and be a Christian.

It's possible to be a hard core macro evolutionist and be a Christian.

politics is more than just abortion and being pro homosexual marriage.

American politics is also more complicated than that Sam. There are pro life feminists (I count myself among their numbers), there are pro life supporters who do not think banning abortion is the right way to go about helping the problem (I count myself among their numbers). There is a whole pro life democrat organization just like there is a pro choice republican organization.

There are pro birth control catholics. There are evangelicals who are not fundamentalists. Nothing is as black and white as that.

I too will be changing my party affiliation by next voting year. I will probably be technically an Independent but identify more with most democratic platforms.

Makeesha said...

Michael - ROFLOL GAD...that's so funny. Now we're going to have to add Gad to Jebus in our mockumentary lexicon

John Lynch said...

Y'know... as I think of first century Roman / Jewish culture, I'd have to say that Jesus was liberal. In fact, I'd say He was ultra-liberal. Breaking Sabbath rules? Ignoring traditions? Redefining religious laws? Chillin' at parties with sinners? Turning water into wine so the party could keep going? Does any of that sound like ancient conservativism to you? No, maybe John the Baptist was conservative... but Jesus was definitely liberal.

Michael said...

John.... You are my hero!!

Sam said...

ok i did put all dems and liberals in the same box. didnt mean to. what i wanted to say is that you can be those and christian as long as you dont stop being christian when you vote. i dont know any dems who do.
to support or vote for someone who supports abortion or homosexual life styles, is to encourage those sins. we are not to cause another to sin. i vote for people who believe in christian morals. most democrats say they are christian, but then support one or both of these issues.
I may not be wise, but I will not be fooled by words like womans choice, or alturnitive life style. I hope i cleared that up.
And let me ask you makeeshe, is it possible to be a christian and a murderer, or rapist or a thief?
As christians, we still sin, but are we not to guide towards christ and being christlike?
And john, christ being liberal back then is not the same as being liberal now. Now if you mean liberal as in different, yes i agree.
My wife put it best. Christ was a conservitive who came to help us liberals.

chuck said...

Suppose there is another conversation going -- not just the liberal or conservative, Republican or Democrat dualism, but something else. Kind of the Brian McLaren "Generous Orthodoxy" thing. Dualism is pretty old news and life is seldom that simple. Jesus, a liberal or conservative? How about Jesus as a new model of something we've never seen before, something outside our human frame of reference, so different that we can't describe it anymore than John the Revelator could describe the new heaven and the new earth.

Makeesha said...

Sam - can you be a Christian and overeat? Can you be a Christian and lack generosity? Can you be a Christian and hold onto possessions to strongly? If being a Christian means being perfect then I'm afraid we're all screwed.

David said...

I happen to be a VERY moderate Republican which thinks that both sides have some good platforms and some bad ones...so yes, darn confiction within me. I feel like Darth Vader.

Jesus is bigger than abortion and homosexuality. If you vote for that platform, you vote against other things God cares about - the environment, the poor, etc.
Jesus is bigger than being anti-abortion and homosexual marriage, because if you vote agianst those things you vote for the death penalty and pre-emptive strikes on other nations...things I think Jesus would be opposed too.

Yes, I'm making GREAT generalizations, which has many holes, but I'm hoping that my making GREAT generaliaztions; we are shown that we can't make make GREAT generalizations like real Christians are Republicans and all democrats will be outside the Kingdom gnashing thier teeth.

Jesus is a King, not a president and although we should be active in politics in this free country of ours, we should remember that Jesus wasn't elected and His the first person we serve.

Michael said...

David that really puts things into perspective. I think we as Americans create a Jesus that often looks like our favorite Political leader. Jesus is Jesus. He can't be confined in the form of any political leader. And I am pretty sure Jesus will never let us down unlike ALL political figures. If Jesus was nothing more than A politician, I think I would become Buddhist or something!!

John Lynch said...

Chuck, thanks for your comment. You & several others have already said it so well... we conform to Jesus - never the other way around. And while adjectives like "liberal" are useful, we're challenged to be cautious in how we label the God of all Reality.

Michael... I love your conrast between Christ the King & human leaders. Jesus will never let us down. He is bigger than any office or institution. He is God... uncompromisingly true & yet sacrificially loving. Great word, brother... especially in this cynical postmodern context!